To claim the “developer” title in the domaining industry, one needs to be able to successfully perform a certain range of tasks.
A developer creates their own content, programs their relational database and codes scripts. A developer designs their own templates, layouts, web sites or modifies those made by others. A developer does not abuse their own title when asked “what do you do”.
In other words, a developer either holds a degree related to programming, systems analysis, web design, graphic design – or they are true experts in the above through lengthy hands-on experience. A developer is not someone using a CMS such as WordPress or that of a parking company’s domain manager.
Now, anyone can name a gathering of individuals whatever they want, particularly when there is an admission fee or further soft-selling of products or services.
Personally, I believe in calling things by their name: Epik’s current conference is not a gathering of developers.
It’s a gathering of domainers that use or want to use the Epik platform, no different than Parked or WhyPark having their own show for their own people. While it’s true that from any gathering of professionals many business to business connections arise, the Epik conference is all about current and potential users of the Epik CMS and business model.
Simple as that.
There are plenty of true developers’ conferences out there; as long as one is not a domainer who somehow wears the “developer” hat once in a blue moon.
I’ll leave you with Steve Ballmer’s monumental speech about software developers.
“a developer either holds a degree related to programming, systems analysis, web design, graphic design β or they are true experts in the above through lengthy hands-on experience.”
I disagree with you on this one. One of the most successful real estate developers in New York City is Larry Silverstein (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Larry_Silverstein). He isn’t an engineer, architect, construction worker, plumber, electrician, or in any other type of position that entails the actual development aspect of his projects. Silverstein is a businessman above all else, and his real estate knowledge gives him the ability to buy great properties at the right price, and hire the right team of people who will build his buildings and then lease them out to yield the greatest return.
Similarly, a developer in our space shouldn’t necessarily have to get his hands dirty in code as long as he knows what he wants and hires someone who can virtually build what he wants to his specs. In my own opinion, a domain developer is someone who can get a money making website built on a great generic domain name.
Touche, Elliot π
As I’ve designed logos for you, you’re the property owner but I’m the developer. I don’t understand what’s so hard to define; after all, “developer” is in the dictionary.
You can call yourself domain investor, project manager etc. but development is well-defined and the term is being abused in the domain industry, for reasons that we all know and we are too timid to discuss.
Well, here’s a chance to unveil the great mysteries of domain development!
I have to agree with Elliot. Real Estate “Developers” are the ones that facilitate the development of the real estate, not the ones that hammer the nails necessarily.
A website developer is the same, it is the person that facilitates the development of the website, not always the one that does the coding.
Now a “Designer” is the person that does the designing so I can be a developer, but not a designer. A developer is a facilitator, no matter how they go about it.
Troy – When I took the stand to talk about development at TRAFFIC Orlando, stating I am a web developer, you would not believe the number of confused looks I received π
Stop associating two unrelated industries. Real estate is not an example about domaining.
My degree says “Systems analyst” with a minor in liberal arts. I’ve done games development in the 80’s. I program, code, design for print/web and can project-manage.
I’m also a domainer. But without the above I would never call myself a “developer”.
Investing in domains is a challenge. To avoid the pitfalls of every industry, one needs to accept what they are – and what they aren’t.
Yes, I will agree most individuals attending that conference are not going to be developing their sites personally but contracting EPIK’s services for development of their portfolio. The likely scenario is some domain acquisitions and exchanges will be made as well. It would be interesting to hear what transpires but in the end who is the primary sponsor? Once upon a time I had a stake in an ecommerce software company which sold the idea of using their software to launch an online business. This was done at conferences throughout the country. Since I was an investor I attended one conference to get a feel of their approach. Somehow I envision a similar setting – an interesting presentation by various industry speakers with the end goal of convincing attendees to build sites on the EPIK platform. I am sure the speakers & presentations are interesting but I just couldn’t justify the expense of hotel, airfare, meals, three days away from work, etc when I am already familiar with their services.
And I guess I have a lot of work to do before I can call myself a developer π
Leonard – Exactly my point, regarding the naming of the conference. I have no doubt that the Epik conference aspires to shift the paradigm of other conferences that domainers attend. In that respect, I wish them best of luck. My objection is the choice of words for the conference name and I believe I explained why.
Its not the developer that counts but the development.
Maki π Yes, the end justifies the means. But I can’t call myself a doctor when I hold no such degree and I don’t think I’m entitled to give medical advice or practice it without one.
How about when you consider a development project that uses a graphic designer, coders, database architect, systems administrator, and other tech people? Who is considered the “developer?” If someone was to ask all of these individuals on a web development team “who is the developer on this project,” they would probably point to the guy paying for it (aka the investor/domain owner)… unless of course it’s because the person asking wants to hire people for his project.
Elliot – Whoever does the work is the developer, provided that they are qualified for the job. The project manager or team leader could be a developer themselves; however, the investor/domain owner is the *client*.
Nothing wrong with identifying the roles in every market π
Can a domainer/investor become proficient as a developer? Of course they can, as long as they perform these tasks well and on a par with certain standards, that’s why I included lengthy, hands-on experience in my definition of a “developer”.
Amen brother. I usually agree with Elliot, but in this case I think he is wrong. The person who pays for work is a client or a site owner, not a developer.
You’re not a developer unless your eyes have bled from marathon coding sessions. Unless you’ve jumped out of your chair exclaiming that you are a god after figuring out an insanely complex logic problem. Unless you’ve smashed your head on the desk, practically in tears, trying to find missing punctuation. If you look at me confused when I say stored procedure, recursion, or any other programming term, you’re not a developer.
I’ve been coding for a decade, not as long as Theo, but still a while for a 26 year old. It always irks me when people who use Fantastico to install WordPress, or don’t even go that far on their own, call themselves developers.
It’s cute that Rob is calling everyone that goes to the Epik conference a developer, but don’t start believing it.
I loved that speech btw, lol.
Michael – I could not have said it better myself. That’s 101% – if any such figure was possible – what the jest of a developer is all about. You get the extra 1% for displaying enthusiasm π
Attendants of Epik’s Seattle conference should go visit Microsoft at Redmond – only 10 miles apart – and decide for themselves.
Anyone here that can use a computer, and I assume everyone does, can “develop” a successful site without any degree. Was learning a computer that hard and did you need a degree? I think a school for domain name development “would” be a great idea but its not needed to be a successful domain name developer. Creativitiy, a willingness to learn and time engagement should be enough produce a developer. I would encourage everyone to become a developer. Even “trying” to be a one is ok with me. We have to wear a lot of hats in this business, I wouldn’t have time to get a degree in each.
Michael C. – A degree is not needed, experience in the field does matter, however, regardless of holding a degree or not.
I agree, trying is half of everything.
You’ve definitely proven along with David that domain assets can be developed “in house”. Until you learned the ropes, you were your own client π
I agree that anyone can become a developer, but only by actually learning the ins and outs. I studied computer science at UMCP, but I learned 90% of what I know on my own, since most colleges don’t teach you web development. They’ll show you C++, C#, and maybe some Java, but I don’t know many universities that get into PHP, AJAX, Javascript, HTML, CSS, etc.
Changing your name servers to Epik’s doesn’t make a developer though.
Acro, while most don’t qualify for the title of developer in the technological sense of the word, some do qualify in the dictionary sense of the word:”one that develops.”
While, I don’t think of myself as a “developer” I do develop websites. I think it’s just semantics, Epik or whoever is not trying to get over, it’s just lack of proper categorical definition and use of the term.
Dean – I believe in using accurate terms and definitions. Once we cross the borders of “semantics” can we start calling eachother by any title we wish? E.g. can I become an MD or add an Esq. after my name, if on occasion I perform massages or give off-the-cuff legal advice?
You could also become a carpenter by paying some guys outside of Home Depot to build you a deck in the magical world of semantics.
I think part of some people’s confusion is that the term is really “web developer”, not just the generic “developer”, but in the lazy world of LOLs and BRBs, the web part became implied from the context.
Here’s what a web developer is, the article also links to software developer, which is relevant:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Web_developer
I don’t see anything in there about rocking a Blogger account.
Well anything can be carried to the extreme, I think in general terms it’s acceptable, I however would not send a resume with “Developer” to an IT firm whom I was trying to get a job with.
I personally would not take offense if you would like to start referring to me as Dr. Dean
π
On a lighter note I think you would get a kick out of this: Semantics(from Greek “ΟΞ·ΞΌΞ±Ξ½ΟΞΉΞΊΟΟ” – semantikos.
It reminds me of that scene in My Big Fat Greek Wedding, where the father is explaining the origin of the word Kimono to the kids and how any word you could think of had it’s origin in Greece, Lol.
Dr. Dean – Thanks for the light side of things π My intention is to have a good, fruitful exchange & conversation. By all means, everyone’s point of view bears a valid amount of self-justification π
About semantics/ΟΞ·ΞΌΞ±Ξ½ΟΞΉΞΊΟΟ – the word has unfortunately lost its meaning in modern Greek (the Wikipedia entry is about the ancient Greek word as described by Liddell/Scott) and currently it means “important” or “of importance”. Mr. Portokalos would be pleased π
I think it was in the 1980’s that “Engineers” were taking offense to the [over]use of their professional designation in other titles. Sanitation Engineer (garbage man) comes to mind… Sounds similar.
Also, I remember having an argument with some guy who had a degree in economics but was writing Lotus 1-2-3 spreadsheets and was using macros to make them so funky/spiffy things that many of the other people in the office were not doing. He called himself a “programmer” and I took offense because having put myself through 4 years of school for programming, I’d never consider myself an “economist”, in the event that I could keep up with conversations with him about economics.
I “understood” economics but was a programmer. I never argued about it with him or anyone else because I realized what a massive waste of time it would be to try to convince people of things that they’ll never ‘get’ or may not want to ‘get’.
Bottom line: its really not worth it. Just do your best work and everything else comes out in the wash. It always has. π
Acro,
It’s all Greek to me π
Always enjoy a healthy debate, it’s a great form of learning and sharpening your wits. Off to feed my girls (dogs).
In a true sense of the meaning.. you absolutely have it right. Any old school programmer would fully understand it and live by it.
In the domain “developer” community it has taken a whole new meaning because as Michael C. mentioned, one has to wear many hats.
@Mike: In fairness, there is a very clear line for the term “engineer”. Especially since life safety is involved with most design work and/or risk of failure with multi-million dollar projects. Professional engineers require licensing and proven competence in a discipline for a reason.
You might say that electricians deal with life safety too and they’re required to be licensed. But it’s nowhere near what’s involved with being an Electrical Engineer. The difference in core knowledge is night and day and goes way beyond semantics. I won’t even dignify the term “sanitation engineer”.
Further, I would submit that someone who doesn’t have a solid understanding of data structures, big O notation and a bachelors-level math background can’t seriously call themselves a software developer. They may be able to make the monthly nut but there’s a huge difference between copy/pasting snippets together and designing an efficient algorithm that is solid and maintainable.
Finally, I’ll leave the semantics of “developer” vs. “developer” to the better minds within this thread.
Mike – great example that “old school” is still en vogue π
Dean – Thank you sir, I appreciate your contribution as always.
Dan – Nothing wrong with “old school” or wearing many hats. But as Michael Sumner said, pointing one’s namservers to Epik’s doesn’t make one a developer. I think that’s one truly epic quote π
SL – Thanks again for some valuable contribution to this exchange. You can’t imagine the scorn of software engineers towards systems analysts at school!
I consider myself to be a website developer and a domain developer – and for that matter a computer programmer ie software developer. I have in the past been a real-estate developer too (on a very small scale).
I think a domain developer can be a word-press “guru”, to me part of developing a domain is making sure it ranks well in the search engine results. While this does involve a certain amount of understanding tech in general – you need to be able to read and understand Google patents for example – it doesn’t really involve anything to do with programming.
I’m 55 and been programming since 1974, developing websites since 1998, developing domains since 1999 and developing photographs until recently.
Developing a domain might involve selling advertising, hiring writers, getting publicity, contracting with a SEO specialist and of course specifying to a website developer what the website needs to do. Oh, and get a website designer.
It would be quite easy to eliminate the website developer, the designer, the SEO person and just use a standard Magento store, sell products, write your own product descriptions, be successful and who is going to argue that it isn’t then a developed domain?
Greg – Although you must be commented for your perseverance and skill diversity, you are apparently the exception to the rule.
The vast majority of domainers that decide to use the term “developer” lack even the basic skills related to design, programming or project development and simply utilize “push button publishing”.
The argument is not about the results, but whether one can provide this as a service to themselves or to others, without any certification, degree or hands-on experience.